Curse

eA-Zaku · May 31, 2005, 05:07 AM // 05:07

If the grind is so bad, why do so many people who "don't have time to seriously game" have time to post on this forum? I think it's been proven beyond a doubt that Guild Wars has no grind when placed on the online RPG scale.

And as for your gripe about quests: I can't think of any quest in any game that didn't involve walking and monsters. If you really wan't to try something fun, try sneaking past the monsters like the Riverside Province mission. Pretend you're Solid Snake or something. Better yet, go play some Metal Gear Solid.

While all your complaints are valid, they're applicable to all online RPG's. Also, it seems for the majority of them, Guild Wars is not the biggest culprit for these complaints. Immature community? Check Diablo II pub duels. Grind? Nevermind...the topic about grind has been done to death.

Chaynsaw · May 31, 2005, 11:03 AM // 11:03

Garric, you're playing the wrong genre. Guild Wars is near the mildest brand of grind you will see in an RPG.

Heavens no... quests that force you to explore the world? There should be a portal from Ascalon City to the Ring of Fire island chain! Infusion runs should be completed passively while you traverse this trans-continental gateway! People should all have to bow to your desires, telepathically even, because under no circumstances should you be required to verbally communicate your displeasure or even try to manage these difficult people or even, *gasp* extricate yourself from hopeless idiots.

"But I dun wannnnnnna walk, my virtual legs are sore!"

I suggest you quit now, before you get a stroke from all this stress.

Templar Valkrye · May 31, 2005, 12:31 PM // 12:31

Well, sure, the game has flaws, but only minor ones. ^^. Lets see, Monks are ass-holes, why, you piss them off. if you dont iss off a monk, you wont have a problem. You make it seem like they caused all the problems, do you think about what YOU might have said before? And yes, monks are powerful, they are strong because there are so few of them. if they were weak they would die pretty fast on thier own.

Grinding ( i have no clue WHAt that is)
from what i gather, it is how the EXP gain is to slow, no no, i just think you are bieng a verry impatient person, if you get EXP to fast, or finish the game to fast it gets boring, and when you said something about going somewhere you have been to, ya, in real life im sure that U.S. wont change where the states are when you leave and come back, nope, the states in U.S. will be where you left them.

The game is hard, so that way it doesn't get to boring. just FYI, if you finish a game, 3 times, why would you continue playing it? Verry simple concept my friend.

and guilding, well, i agree with "Manadarthehealer" the guild stuff IS expensive so the guild chips in, i have like 15 people in my guild, we all contributed about 2k-5k each, and we got a guild hall, capes, and then, I PERSONALLY paid them back, ( i thought of it as a loan, they said that it was for the guild, but i paid them all back regardless) money is not that hard to get, go fighting on your own ( if you can) and get items, sell them, get money on the floor, sell items for less ( fur square = 100 gold) you well get money pretty fast, i think you are just a bit spoiled, and a bit impatiend. and as for the enis on the minimap... who cares? when they die, leave them, and like Manadarthehealer, i have yet to run into jerks, i mean sure, they aren't the nicest in the world, but hey, they aren't asses either. ^^. i think you exaggerate a lil to much.

-Templar Valkrye

P.S. Manadarthehealer, who is that on your icon, Furion Stormrage?

DrSLUGFly · May 31, 2005, 12:38 PM // 12:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samuel

I'd just like to point out that drawing penises on the minimap never gets old.

The trick is to draw a properly proportioned figure on the minimap while the party is on the run... a penis? a giant oval with a small line at one end, no talent needed.

chalt2 · May 31, 2005, 12:50 PM // 12:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samuel

I'd just like to point out that drawing penises on the minimap never gets old.

Thank you for that post, very informative and as a result I have increased my in-game ignore list by one.

DrSLUGFly · May 31, 2005, 01:18 PM // 13:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by chalt2

Thank you for that post, very informative and as a result I have increased my in-game ignore list by one.

I wasn't included??? Cuz I don't draw pencils, wa ha (censoring myself now for my own mental health).

I don't really get the grind, but I openly admit that I'm not yet at the areas where most people say they're frustrated with the grind.

But in relation to the complaint about quest distances and themes I ask this. Look at what I've proposed for distances and themes and then try to add a new one to the list.

Distances:
Go somewhere in town
Go out the gate
Go somewhere a tad distant
Go somewhere far away

Themes:
--Speak to somebody:
carry a message/object to be delivered

--Kill somebody/something
free a town
dispose of a threat
push back invaders
cleans an area
destroy an object

--find somebody/something
locate object/person and return it to safety
do a gauntlet run to a specified place

--protect somebody/something
maintain somebody's life during a timer
maintain somebody's life for a distance

Although people could no doubt think of objectives and goals that aren't listed here, can you think of a category that's not listed here? Pretty much anything we can do in an RPG game or even a game in general comes down to speak, kill, find and protect.

Starsky-sama · May 31, 2005, 01:27 PM // 13:27

-well Garric. the game has flaws (as all games do).
-from what youve explained. you just havent been so lucky with the community. there will always be a few "bad apples" (as in all games do).
but im sure youve met good ones as well.
-i guess you really just have to screen ppl out before you group with them. from what you explained about those "guild" ppl. they shouldnt even be in a guild. if they act that way. sheesh. but i guess if their main purpose was to act all badazz w/ a cape. that's their choice.

-personally i solo more than 50% of the time. I interact with the community only when i need to. i dont bother anyone and no one bothers me. its all good.hehe

-my only main flaw about this game is----the lost/stuck henchies.period.

so, Garric hope you feel differently when the 1st expansion comes out and continue with it, and just try to stay away / ignore those immature ppl, its alot more enjoyable playing the game w/o stressin'.

-cheers.

SOT · May 31, 2005, 01:45 PM // 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

And I don't think I'll be getting an expansion pack. This might be a long post so bear with me.

First I'll start out what's good about this game: No montly fee. This is great, because when I quit this game, I won't have wasted more money than I should have. Skill based. There are no potions or instant spells that own everyone. There's a lot of skill involved. Good gfx, nuff said. No PVP ganking. I can go do an area or mission without being ganked by a guy 10 lvls higher than you calling you a noob and killing you with one hit.

But this game has some very serious flaws that some people need to consider, many things that are wrong with this game, things that are built into the game and can not be fixed.

The Worst Community Ever

At the point of that last line appearing in your post, I stopped reading. Blanket statements like that do not foster effective communication from those who may agree or disagree, at least not where I come from. It's like saying all women should clean house.

Personally, I am wondering if you have played anything else MMO but this. I came to this game from Lineage II, and let me tell you, I would endure ANY game mechanic failure to avoid the ganking bullshit. I had a level 40 character, a guild of 30 people, and I continuously encountered people who would kill me and say:

"I did not kill you for the competitive nature of the game, I did so because you are a newbie, and I wanted the off chance that by you dying you would drop something from your inventory you really really worked hard to attain, just to have it and you don't."

That kinda shit DAILY.

I think the worst game communities are the one's where the game dies out.

Louis Ste Colombe · May 31, 2005, 01:47 PM // 13:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cymmina

This is really the worst part of trying to play with people, and it is the players who have caused this grief. I was in a super lame guild that expected everyone to use TS/Vent. They couldn't give two shits about anyone who wasn't using it. I don't want to listen to people talk when I can read much faster, nor do I want to listen to people mumble into the mic. What about deaf/mute players? A few years back, a guy in my Starcraft guild was deaf. Plus, could you imagine how well people would cope with having a *real* girl on their team? No thanks.

You can't even get a tombs group anymore without TS/Vent. I got kicked out of a group for Underworld because I didn't have TS, when it was the leader invited *me* right after I broadcasted my distaste for voice chat. The game has excellent features that allow communication with your team without forcing you to type at all. The player enforced requirement of TS/Vent is just stupid.

And people wonder why I'd rather play with hechmen than real people.

I fully understand the problem. I played MTW/RTW in a clan with 50% real girls, and there were no way we would have accepted TS/ Vent. There are plenty of alternatives, + the more you play with the same people, the less you need to talk. On top of that, members are from all over the world; and not everyone is able to understand spoken English in a hurry; written messages are easier to interpret for many... No silly accent problem.
And MTW/RTW does not have half the feature for fast communication GW has.

That kind of pre conceived idea (not taking ppl who don't have TS, or who play a class that is deemed inferior...) is a kind of a pain...

As far as communication goes... Maybe a few change in the minimap could prove helpful. It can be made better, with more information displayed on it.

First, I'd like to have teamplayers with slightly different shades, so that I know who is dark blue versus light blue... I got anonymous dots, and would appreciate to differenciate them a bit in a visual way on the minimap.

Second, maybe displaying spell being cast on the minimap? As a small symbol on the map just above the dot?

If that is already possible, I'd sure appreciate to know how to do it

Good luck and have fun,

Louis,

Garric · May 31, 2005, 02:04 PM // 14:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chaynsaw

Garric, you're playing the wrong genre. Guild Wars is near the mildest brand of grind you will see in an RPG.

Heavens no... quests that force you to explore the world? There should be a portal from Ascalon City to the Ring of Fire island chain! Infusion runs should be completed passively while you traverse this trans-continental gateway! People should all have to bow to your desires, telepathically even, because under no circumstances should you be required to verbally communicate your displeasure or even try to manage these difficult people or even, *gasp* extricate yourself from hopeless idiots.

"But I dun wannnnnnna walk, my virtual legs are sore!"

I suggest you quit now, before you get a stroke from all this stress.

Ugh, oh how I hate talk to people like you. Name me another good RPG that forces you to do EVERY quest by walking 10 miles into the desert, fighting the same enemies (Since the map isn't a random map.). Those fights are tedious and boring, you've done them already, except now you have to do it again since you have to do a quest. I'm not saying make all the quests easy, I'm saying that the quests are stupid, repetative, wastes of time, since you must do the same thing in them (kill, find, bring back.). As if the devs specifically made the world huge just so they could stick in a bunch of quests that forced you to go as far as you could in different directions from town so you could "explore the map". Let me tell you, me, and all of my friends, after a week of playing, didn't want to "do" the quests anymore since they were so stupid and long, so we just ran to the green dot on the screen to get XP and skills.

SOT · May 31, 2005, 02:08 PM // 14:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

Ugh, oh how I hate talk to people like you.

Which would explain why my post wasn't responded to. Reason takes time

Niare · May 31, 2005, 05:03 PM // 17:03

I have just one point of view about the topic of walking to complete quests. I know it's probably been brought up before, but honestly. Try playing WoW, Ultima Online (back in the day), EQ, etc. You have to walk -everywhere-. You can't warp back to town like we can in GW. Personally, I'm thankful that we can warp from town to town...Imagine having guildmates in Amnoon Oasis and you're in Lion's Arch and they want you to join them for a quest or mission or something and you have to travel from Lion's Arch to Amnoon Oasis on foot.

Honestly. The game is not even that old. Of course there are a few flaws here and there, but that is what updates and expansions are for. I paid my money for this game so I can have fun. I enjoy games like this, it kind of reminds me of NWN and D2 all in one. And, after all is said and done, it's just a game, meant for entertainment. If people don't have fun playing, then as others have said, this isn't the right game for them.

Mistress Eyahl · Jun 01, 2005, 08:49 AM // 08:49

Just out of interest, if you don't want quests which involve, "Talk Walk Fight Talk Fight Walk Reward" ... then what would you like? I mean, the whole bases of this game is a storyline. To find out information and the story you need to talk to people.

Don't understand why you have to moan about a game that you don't like. If you don't like it, make your own. I always feel bad for people who developed the game if they see stuff like this. They worked so hard to try and bring you everything they think you want. Come on, this MMORPG has some really strong points. Seems when you moan you just throw it back in their faces. Beggars can't be choosers.

Bazooka · Jun 01, 2005, 04:33 PM // 16:33

I like your points and sadly can commiserate on many of them. Here are my practical responses that give me stress free gaming

The Worst Community Ever

Its the Internet. People will act stupid/immature because they feel there are no repurcussions.Theres no monthly fee so a lot of young people play.
What do you get when you have young people that feel they can get away with anything? You have the Internet Community. It is pandemic to anything Internet related
So what can you do? Find cool people and add them to your friends list. Only play with these people. Make a guild of these cool people
This is oversimplistic, but amazingly it works. It will require work (thoughtful socialization and paying attention) on your part. Sorry if this may be too hard or time consuming. You get what you put in.

Monk Class Flaws:
This isnt a flaw in the game mechanic. In all games you need damage dealers and damage mitigators. Amazingly EVERY SINGLE PROFESSION in guildwars is capable of doing either or both AT THE SAME TIME. The problem you site, is a people problem.
See the previous "solution" above.

Huge Grind
Heh this one is a sticky situation indeed. For my hardcore PVP players friends out there, its a very sensitive topic. The only thing I can say to them is, ANet never hid the fact how the system was going to be. They guranteed you could be competitive without grinding and this is ABSOLUTELY TRUE. However, if you got dedication and time you can aquire tools(skills,gear..etc) to make competing easier. I still believe that this is optional. I take great pride in makeing groups and beating other players with "scrub n00b skills" and "damn premade" builds.

A lot of good friends overreacted and left because they got a taste of Guildwars potential in the Alpha and Beta but now realize they dont want to spend the time to get that potential back. Its cool, no hard feelings see ya'll in Battlefield 2

If you're complaining about the "grind" in RP, I wont even grace that with a response.

Too Difficult
I agree the game is hard. I disagree that there is no solution to the difficulty level.
Simple answer is group with real human beings. However,I know of several people that are masters of henchmen wrangling and handily "solved" this installment of the game without aid

Guilding
Yes stuff is expensive. Yes there is inflation in this economy. Whats your solution to solve inflation? There are some people in Washinton DC that really need to talk to you
Regarding sigils, have you ever considered actually competeing for a sigil instead of farming money to buy one?

If you are stressing over this game on your free time, then you need to take a break.
Meet some real human beings , talk them into playing with you. I've got a feeling though, if you find some cool people, you'll have much better choices to spend your time than a silly video game. Good job my friend, you've won Life.

ElevenBravo · Jun 01, 2005, 04:35 PM // 16:35

To the original poster: No. Now to find out what a bad community really is like go play Lineage 2. I hope you dont mind getting ganked.

jubilee64 · Jun 01, 2005, 04:52 PM // 16:52

To the OP:

Never has an online game made it so easy to avoid people you don't get on with.

If you are running in to arguments all the time then odds are you need to look at your own attitude. As a monk, the worst types to get grouped with are not the youngsters doodling on the map, but the santimonious self-proclaimed experts who insist they know your job better than you do and complain everytime you make a value decision to let them die and keep someone else afloat with your badly depleted energy.

Your points are well put nonetheless. Chill out, relax, and remember its only a game. Help peeps and you generally get good responses. I have had a lot of excellent random grouping in this game. Sure I've had a couple of bad ones, but c'est la vie; once you and your guild m8s have ascended you'll spend very little time in random groups.

Sorry if I've repeated any1 elses points

Nokomis · Jun 01, 2005, 06:02 PM // 18:02

I don't get this attitude that one should NOT criticize this game. Huh? The OP is right, this game DOES have flaws, and there is nothing wrong at all with pointing them out. Gods forbid anyone should actually THINK about the game and ways to improve it...let's just walk around looking blissed out and say it is all swell...

I bet you also think anyone who criticizes the President is unpatriotic, don't you.

eA-Zaku · Jun 01, 2005, 10:55 PM // 22:55

Many people have agreed that there are flaws. Take a look.

nechronius · Jun 01, 2005, 11:20 PM // 23:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

This guy is a crazy troll, trying to get me in trouble. I told you already I don't use AIM. I didn't do any messaging to you.

I'm going to have to side with Garric on this specific argument although I disagree with his opening statements in this thread.

The most likely explanation is that some third party saw this as the perfect opportunity to make more trouble. Heck why not, MCS makes his AIM ID clearly available and it wouldn't take any effort by someone to stir up the pot and start this argument. After all, no repercussions as someone already said.

Bloodyblackthorn · Jun 16, 2005, 06:47 PM // 18:47

Can't we just lock this tread and get on with our lives??? Sure, Garric, GW has flaws and isn't perfect and I do respect your opinion but please, can't we just lock this thread?